White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

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White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby toucana on January 22nd, 2017, 6:58 am 

crowds.jpg
Trump 2017 and Obama 2009 inauguration day crowds
Sean Spicer the new White House Press spokesman got off to an interesting start during a heated press conference on Saturday by attacking the press for supposedly printing 'lying reports' about the size of the crowds attending Donald Trump’s inauguration day ceremonies in Washington DC.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-38707722

In defiance of all logic, and the clearest possible evidence from aerial photographs, Sean Spicer denied that the crowds attending Trump’s swearing in had been much smaller than those attending Barack Obama’s ceremony in January 2009, and in remarks echoing those by Donald Trump in a bizarre speech made at the CIA headquarters in Langley Virginia tried to insist that the crowds attending Trump’s inauguration had been “the largest audience ever to witness an inauguration in history, period”. Mr Spicer who declined to take any questions went on to warn that “the press are going to pay a big price for their dishonesty”.

National Parks officials no longer supply estimates of the sizes of crowds attending public events in Washington DC because of earlier politicised rows about such estimates, but reporters who have studied aerial panorama photographs taken from the top of the Washington monument just before midday on both inauguration days have concluded that as few as 250,000 attended Trump’s inauguration day as opposed to the 1.8 million who attended Obama’s inauguration in January 2009. Trump’s inauguration day crowd was also comfortably eclipsed by the estimated 500,000 women who attended a protest rally in Washington against his presidency the following day.

The use of the term “lying press” by Spicer is a worrying echo of the term Lügenpresse favoured by Goebbels and other leaders of the Nazi Third Reich from the 1930s onwards. Originally coined by conservative Catholic pamphleteers in Germany in the later 19th century, it was enthusiatically adopted by Hitler’s regime as a term of excoriation for media critics of his divisive and racist policies: vilifcation that rapidly turned into violent physical attacks on reporters.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/10/24/the-ugly-history-of-luegenpresse-a-nazi-slur-shouted-at-a-trump-rally/?utm_term=.eeaa5faf5022

An article posted last October by the Washington Post noted the re-emergence of the term Lügenpresse when video of two Donald Trump supporters shouting the word at rallies began to circulate. In Germany the term has acquired an ugly new currency after being re-adopted by the stridently racist anti-immigration Pegida movement. German media members are now unable to cover Pegida organised events without employing private security personnel after several reporters who risked going in without bodyguards were beaten up.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 22nd, 2017, 11:21 am 

Toucana, many ordinary Germans, and then people on the conservative websites here in the US, have been very accurately using the word "Lugenpresse" to describe the press since the 2016 Cologne New Years Eve rape and sexual assault scandal in Germany.

The MSM in Germany, Europe, and elsewhere at first tried to ignore and completely hide the story about this for a number of days, and then tried to lie about the actual number of women who were raped and sexually assaulted here. http://www.spiegel.de/international/ger ... 79049.html

No one can seem to agree on the actual numbers raped or assulted, but I think it is somewhere around a thousand now(!) "The MSM loves and always supports women right?" :)
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby Braininvat on January 22nd, 2017, 11:34 am 

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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 22nd, 2017, 11:43 am 

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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby Forest_Dump on January 22nd, 2017, 12:11 pm 

Might be a lot of things but Big Brother definitely leaps to mind.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 22nd, 2017, 12:17 pm 

Forest_Dump » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:11 am wrote:Might be a lot of things but Big Brother definitely leaps to mind.


I definitely agree Forest, and I have been comparing the MSM to this for many years now(or for one example, "right think", "right speak" = modern day "Political Correctness") You were talking about the "Lugenpresse" right Forest? :)
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby toucana on January 22nd, 2017, 12:47 pm 

I found it quite interesting that the German newspaper article in Der Spiegel cited by Rojanec contained a graphic about the timeline frequency of the usage of the term Lügenpresse which as printed rather disingenuously stopped at the beginning of 1933, the same year the Nazi party came to power in Germany. You have to click and open the graphic in a new tab to see the enormous upward spike in references to the "Lying Press" that ensued under the Nazi leadership between 1933 and 1945 during the Third Reich.

The term is so debased and so revealing, that no responsible press spokesman would ever use it. Not unless they happened to be employed and briefed by a flagrant Alt-Right sympathiser like Steve Bannon the former Breitbart editor-in-chief who was recently appointed as a special adviser by Donald Trump. Bannon incidentally is said to have largely written Donald Trump's inaugural address with the help of Stephen Miller, and he did so by channelling the values of one of his heroes, the seventh president Andrew Jackson (potus 1829-37) who is probably best remembered as the author of the Indian Removal act of 1830.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/cheats/2017/01/21/trump-s-inauguration-speech-written-by-steve-bannon-stephen-miller.html?via=desktop&source=copyurl

Whilst we are on the subject of rape, what term would you like to use for the persistent refusal of Donald Trump's loyal supporters to engage with the fact that he is a self-confessed sexual predator who enjoys assaulting women ?
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby Braininvat on January 22nd, 2017, 1:14 pm 

"Enablers."

By pretending Trump's infamous audiotape was "just locker room talk," it says it is okay to speak about women this way and that the actions boasted about are really not so bad if you think you're a sexy fellow and have a fat wallet. The enabling also turns a blind eye to Trump's actual sexual gropings, abusive remarks, sex parties, etc. I think women are marching in US streets because they don't want to see their gains of the past century eroded by the Pig -in-Chief.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby Dave_C on January 22nd, 2017, 1:49 pm 

Trump has the disposition of an insecure toddler who needs constant attention and an audience to whom he can proclaim how great he is.

What's scary is that so many people don't recognize this personality disorder and/or don't consider it a character flaw. This is the same character flaw common to dictators and others who desire more and more power.

(Trump) "Had a great meeting at CIA Headquarters yesterday, packed house, paid great respect to Wall... "

But while Trump saw the speech as a win, recently departed CIA chief John Brennen said he was "deeply saddened" by Trump's speech, where his focus seemed to stray from the CIA agents in attendance to his own accomplishments.

"Former CIA Director Brennan is deeply saddened and angered at Donald Trump's despicable display of self-aggrandizement in front of CIA's Memorial Wall of Agency heroes," Brennan's former of deputy chief of staff Nick Shapiro said...

Politico: http://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/d ... ion-233986

What's refreshing is that so many people DO recognize this personality disorder.

That said, I'm hoping he at least can do something about the nation's mounting dept. Hopefully Trump gets his ego stroked enough by his many eunuch's to focus his attention on doing something useful with his term in office.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby zetreque on January 22nd, 2017, 2:04 pm 

Being one to not fully trust the media myself, I looked into this yesterday. It's absolutely ridiculous.

Anyone in the world with internet access can look up the live webcam of the National Mall and compare it to ground photos and people can see themselves walking around on the ground. Not to mention the archive footage and also comparing ground traffic with metro tickets, buses, and dozens of other cameras around the city.


It would be insane to try to doctor the footage. What makes more sense is the consistently delusional man who is now the new president and now his administration. It was obvious months ago but hopefully more and more people will finally get it.

http://www.earthcam.com/network/index.php?country=us&page=DC
http://www.earthcam.com/usa/dc/nationalmall/?cam=nationalmall
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 22nd, 2017, 3:00 pm 

We have moved on from discussing the "Lugenpresse" to Trump's alledged sexual proclivities again?

There are also a lot of allegations on the web today about HRC possibly being involved in lesbian orgies when she was in college, and even suspicions today about her very close relationship with Huma. The MSM of course never investigated the same rumors like they would have for Trump, because it would have of course turned off a lot of potential Hillary voters if either was actually true.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby Lomax on January 22nd, 2017, 4:16 pm 

ronjanec » January 22nd, 2017, 8:00 pm wrote:We have moved on from discussing the "Lugenpresse" to Trump's alledged sexual proclivities again?

There are also a lot of allegations on the web today about HRC possibly being involved in lesbian orgies when she was in college

Now she gets my vote. She should have used this for her October surprise.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 22nd, 2017, 4:26 pm 

"for her October surprise"? I was actually hoping WikiLeaks could have shed some light on this for their grand finale October surprise Lomax. Oh well, alls well that ends well right? :)
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 22nd, 2017, 4:47 pm 

Before I have to go, this discussion reminds of a very famous Drudge Report headline from last August about Huma and Hillary, after it was reported that Huma was seperating from Weiner: "She's had enough Weiner!...Huma Chooses Hillary" Snark! :)

http://www.advocate.com/politics/2016/8 ... r-headline
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby toucana on January 22nd, 2017, 9:37 pm 

Kellyanne Conway, a senior White House aide, told NBC’s Meet the Press on Sunday Spicer had merely been offering “alternative facts”, a phrase that was received with widespread astonishment.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/22/donald-trump-kellyanne-conway-inauguration-alternative-facts

You just could not make this stuff up if you tried !
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 22nd, 2017, 11:39 pm 

The networks are still rambling on about "this extremely important issue"? Ok, but how come Clinton stooge, and professional Democrat George Stupidnapolis, claiming to offer "fair and unbiased interviews" for years on his Sunday morning talk show has not also been meet with similar widespread astonishment?

"Alternative facts"? The more I actually think about this, the more I think she was actually making fun of the media's "facts" and offering an alternative?
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby hyksos on January 22nd, 2017, 11:56 pm 

Washington DC is a liberal enclave as a geographic accident. Naturally, the low attendance at a Trump inauguration will be the result of that geography.

But further, why didn't Kelly-Anne and Spicer just say this? Why the need to pretend like Trump drew the "largest crowd in recorded history"? Further, Spicer must have known ahead of time that the parks service (or police or whoever it is) no longer counts crowd numbers for inaugurations.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 23rd, 2017, 12:06 am 

That's a very good point about the attendence hyksos.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby toucana on January 23rd, 2017, 6:44 am 

It's not all bad news for Donald Trump this week. Apparently a town called Ryazan in the boondocks of Russia wants to rename a street in his honour.

http://news.sky.com/story/why-do-russians-want-to-name-a-street-after-donald-trump-10739664

Local historian Sergey Bizyukin is a fan, and has launched a petition which has garnered 274 signatures to rename a drab snowy track lined with crumbling wooden buildings after his favourite American politician.

"He definitely is a very interesting character and talent," said Mr Bizyukin. The run-down street in Ryazan Oblask 122 miles southeast of Moscow is currently named 'Godless Street'.
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Ryazan Oblask
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby BadgerJelly on January 23rd, 2017, 9:12 am 

First we had "post truth", then "false news" and now we have "alternative facts".
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 23rd, 2017, 9:47 am 

Most everyone here seems to be taking this as a "given" that the Inuguration numbers were down, when it was again estimated by the not always truthful press corps, who of course have absolutely no use for our new President.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby Forest_Dump on January 23rd, 2017, 10:01 am 

Whatever else comes of this, the "alternative facts" meme is going to be something that sticks.

Ronjanec, the Whitehouse press may well be unfair but, once in office, it is imperative for the White House to be seen as open, transparent and able to communicate to all Americans because sometimes what the White House has to say is actually very important and there can be all kinds of consequences if they are not listened to and believed. Suppose there is some kind of huge potential threat (terroist, economic, health, natural disaster, etc.) and the White House needs to get information to Americans for some reason or the other. The White House may not be able to afford having the press wonder if these are facts or "alternative facts". Right or wrong, unfairly baited by a biased press corps or not, don't you see that it is imperative that the White House press secretary have at least some semblance of credibility? Spicer and Conway may well have been unfairly attacked, provoked or whatever but in this battle with the biased, leftie, blood-thirsty liberal press they got creamed and the administration must take measures to get back on some kind of even footing.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 23rd, 2017, 10:38 am 

Yes, it is very important that a new administration provides factual information to the press Forest, so that the citizens of the same country(and other countries) can start to trust them on a regular basis when trying to plan their personal lives and futures...but;

I personally believe that the press is out to literally destroy the new President and his administration, and will do everything in their power to make them look bad(no matter what factual information they do provide), and to hell with the country(I really hope that I am wrong about this, but I again do not believe so) And on the other hand you have President Trump who is a real fighter, who does not seem to back down from anyone who tries to bully him.

Where this really dangerous situation is going I honestly don't know, but it is of course something that has literally just started, and I guess we will just have to wait and see how this all turns out.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby toucana on January 23rd, 2017, 11:58 am 

Bergman.jpg
Ingrid Bergman - 'Gaslight' 1944

One term you may encounter in the context of reality manipulation is 'Gaslighting'. It is derived from the plot of a 1944 film directed by George Cukor starring Ingrid Bergman and Charles Boyer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaslight_(1944_film)

Gaslighting has been defined as:
a form of manipulation through persistent denial, misdirection, contradiction, and lying in an attempt to destabilize and delegitimize a target. Its intent is to sow seeds of doubt in the targets, hoping to make them question their own memory, perception, and sanity.””


The same source adds:
Sociopaths and narcissists frequently use gaslighting tactics. Sociopaths consistently transgress social mores, break laws, and exploit others, but typically are also convincing liars, sometimes charming ones, who consistently deny wrongdoing. Thus, some who have been victimized by sociopaths may doubt their own perceptions.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaslighting
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 23rd, 2017, 12:09 pm 

Who are you saying is guilty of this 'Gaslighting' Toucana?
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby Lomax on January 23rd, 2017, 12:24 pm 

ronjanec » January 23rd, 2017, 3:38 pm wrote:Yes, it is very important that a new administration provides factual information to the press Forest, so that the citizens of the same country(and other countries) can start to trust them on a regular basis when trying to plan their personal lives and futures...but;

I personally believe that the press is out to literally destroy the new President and his administration, and will do everything in their power to make them look bad(no matter what factual information they do provide), and to hell with the country

The president is not the country. The left-leaning press will always do what they can do destroy a right-leaning president, and the right-leaning press will always do what they can to destroy a left-leaning president. What matters is how the administration deals with it. In this case, they have dealt with it by lies and narcissism.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby toucana on January 23rd, 2017, 12:26 pm 

Rojanec,
Who do you think sounds most like a plausible candidate ? To wit - a sociopathic narcissist and liar who consistently transgresses social mores, exploits others, contradicts himself at every possible opportunity and denies all wrongdoing when questioned ?
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby Braininvat on January 23rd, 2017, 12:41 pm 

I don't know if Trump is really skilled enough to achieve gaslighting. Gaslighting actually requires some subtlety and intelligence to work on a subject. Trump seems more skilled at making me doubt HIS sanity, rather than my own.
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 23rd, 2017, 1:54 pm 

toucana » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:26 am wrote:Rojanec,
Who do you think sounds most like a plausible candidate ? To wit - a sociopathic narcissist and liar who consistently transgresses social mores, exploits others, contradicts himself at every possible opportunity and denies all wrongdoing when questioned ?


Yeah, that's who I thought you were talking about Toucana. :)
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Re: White House Attacks ‘Lying Press’

Postby ronjanec on January 23rd, 2017, 2:01 pm 

Braininvat » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:41 am wrote:I don't know if Trump is really skilled enough to achieve gaslighting. Gaslighting actually requires some subtlety and intelligence to work on a subject. Trump seems more skilled at making me doubt HIS sanity, rather than my own.


Defeated all comers when almost everyone said he had absolutely no chance to do this, and when everything else was stacked against him even his own political party? You may be right about some of the things you have said about him Biv, but you are probably really underestimating this guy.
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