How can Quarks be likewise polarities?

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How can Quarks be likewise polarities?

Postby handmade on May 20th, 2017, 6:17 pm 

Three Quarks make up a Proton, however three like wise polarity Quarks can't make up a Proton?
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Re: Rub a dub dub ...

Postby Faradave on May 21st, 2017, 12:46 pm 

...three quarks in a tub (i.e. baryon).

"According to the quark model, the properties of hadrons are primarily determined by their so-called valence quarks. For example, a proton is composed of two up quarks (each with electric charge + 2⁄3, for a total of + 4⁄3 together) and one down quark (with electric charge − 1⁄3)."
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Re: Rub a dub dub ...

Postby handmade on May 21st, 2017, 6:49 pm 

Faradave » May 21st, 2017, 11:46 am wrote:...three quarks in a tub (i.e. baryon).

"According to the quark model, the properties of hadrons are primarily determined by their so-called valence quarks. For example, a proton is composed of two up quarks (each with electric charge + 2⁄3, for a total of + 4⁄3 together) and one down quark (with electric charge − 1⁄3)."

Thank you, I can ''see'' how that could work.

Do Quarks/protons emit a field?
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Re: Playing outfield

Postby Faradave on May 21st, 2017, 8:21 pm 

handmade wrote:Do Quarks/protons emit a field?

Yes. Quarks are always observed bound to other quarks. Protons are composite particles (baryons) made of three quarks. The properties of a proton result from the combined properties of the quarks and their energies. (The quarks have binding energy and energy of motion, which can be rather complicated.)

The most obvious result is that a proton is found exhibit both mass and electric charge which can be measured as electric and gravitational fields. When an electric charge is seen to be in motion, its electric field is also measured as a magnetic field to a degree relating to the observed velocity.
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Re: Playing outfield

Postby handmade on May 22nd, 2017, 6:58 am 

Faradave » May 21st, 2017, 7:21 pm wrote:
handmade wrote:Do Quarks/protons emit a field?

Yes. Quarks are always observed bound to other quarks. Protons are composite particles (baryons) made of three quarks. The properties of a proton result from the combined properties of the quarks and their energies. (The quarks have binding energy and energy of motion, which can be rather complicated.)

The most obvious result is that a proton is found exhibit both mass and electric charge which can be measured as electric and gravitational fields. When an electric charge is seen to be in motion, its electric field is also measured as a magnetic field to a degree relating to the observed velocity.



Thank you for your reply.

How do we distinguish the emitted field from an electron ''shell''?

Could the electron shell be an emitted field as opposed to an attracted electron?
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Re: Exorbitant

Postby Faradave on May 22nd, 2017, 10:28 am 

"Shell" typically refers to a region (an "orbital") occupied by an electron in relation to an atomic nucleus (i.e. at least one proton). Unlike the paths of satellite orbits around a planet, which can vary smoothly to different altitudes, orbitals occupy specific regions and are disallowed in between. There are similar restricted orbitals for protons, within the nucleus. The opposite electric fields of an electron and proton attract them toward each other but the electron's orbital restrictions limit how close they can get. This gives physical structure to atoms.

A free electron does not occupy an orbital and so would not be associated with a "shell".
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Re: Exorbitant

Postby handmade on May 22nd, 2017, 8:23 pm 

Faradave » May 22nd, 2017, 9:28 am wrote:"Shell" typically refers to a region (an "orbital") occupied by an electron in relation to an atomic nucleus (i.e. at least one proton). Unlike the paths of satellite orbits around a planet, which can vary smoothly to different altitudes, orbitals occupy specific regions and are disallowed in between. There are similar restricted orbitals for protons, within the nucleus. The opposite electric fields of an electron and proton attract them toward each other but the electron's orbital restrictions limit how close they can get. This gives physical structure to atoms.

A free electron does not occupy an orbital and so would not be associated with a "shell".



What do you mean by a free electron? Do you mean unattached electrons? are these detectable? What exactly do we mean by an electron? a particle of electricity?
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Re: How can Quarks be likewise polarities?

Postby Faradave on May 23rd, 2017, 12:05 am 

handmade wrote:by a free electron? Do you mean unattached electrons?

Yes. An electron not bound in an atom. The electrons of metal atoms are so loosely bound they are free to swarm around from atom to atom. These commonly constitute electric current through metal wires.

handmade wrote: are these detectable?

An electron is a readily detectable subatomic particle. When you get a spark touching something metal after walking across a carpet (usually on a dry day), those are electrons arcing from a negatively charged body to a relatively positive body.

handmade wrote:What exactly do we mean by an electron?

It is time to do a little reading. An electron is the lightest massive particle in a neutral atom. It carries a unit of electrical charge which, by convention, is designated "negative".
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Re: How can Quarks be likewise polarities?

Postby handmade on May 23rd, 2017, 5:07 pm 

Faradave » May 22nd, 2017, 11:05 pm wrote:
by convention, is designated "negative".


If I recall correctly , history named the polarities the wrong way around and the electron is actually the positive?
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Re: Current Events

Postby Faradave on May 23rd, 2017, 11:31 pm 

As electric current is, by convention, considered the flow of energy from positive to negative terminals, it would have been more convenient if Ben Franklin had called the electric charge associated with electrons "positive". As it is, electrons actually flow the opposite direction of "electric current". Engineers have learned to cope with this.

The designation "positive" or "negative" is completely arbitrary but its important to be consistent once the designation has been made.
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Re: Current Events

Postby handmade on May 24th, 2017, 9:09 am 

Faradave » May 23rd, 2017, 10:31 pm wrote:As electric current is, by convention, considered the flow of energy from positive to negative terminals, it would have been more convenient if Ben Franklin had called the electric charge associated with electrons "positive". As it is, electrons actually flow the opposite direction of "electric current". Engineers have learned to cope with this.

The designation "positive" or "negative" is completely arbitrary but its important to be consistent once the designation has been made.

Thank you, you are really easy to talk too and easy to understand and definitely know your '''stuff''.

Is the electrons flowing the opposite way anything to do with Tesla and AC? or is that barking up the wrong tree?

Are you saying electrons flow centripetal like gravity? any connection there?
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Re: Current trends

Postby Faradave on May 24th, 2017, 10:10 am 

With direct current (DC), electrons flow through wire in one direction, similar to water through a pipe. That's why they share the name "current".

However, with alternating current (AC) the electrons instead vibrate back and forth, similar to air particles in a sound wave.

Gravity and centripetal force are not really involved with this.
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Re: How can Quarks be likewise polarities?

Postby Braininvat on May 24th, 2017, 1:35 pm 

It makes household wiring terms sort of confusing. We call black the "hot" wire and white "neutral," as if the electrons were consistently flowing from negative to positive, from the black wire to the white wire. But, if polarity is switching 60 times a second, then both wires would be "hot."
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Re: How can Quarks be likewise polarities?

Postby Dave_Oblad on May 24th, 2017, 2:06 pm 

Hi all,

BIV wrote: But, if polarity is switching 60 times a second, then both wires would be "hot."

Hot, is by definition, the wire that can shock you.. if you are grounded.

The Neutral wire is tied to Earth Ground and thus you can't get a shock if you bridged yourself between that Neutral wire and a pipe into the Ground. This is also called a Ground Wire. On Three Prong plugs, the Ground Wire (round lead) is usually tied to the Neutral Wire (wider flat lead) somewhere. The "HOT" wire is the smaller of two flat leads and has an alternating potential of +/- 175 Volts (about) relative to Neutral or Ground wires (for single phase AC). This is the American Standard, I'm not familiar with other countries.

Neutral or Ground wires are attached to the Metal Chassis of appliances to prevent shock hazards (Refrigerators, Microwave Ovens, Toasters and Desk Top Computers.. to name a few).

Regards,
Dave :^)
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Re: How can Quarks be likewise polarities?

Postby handmade on May 24th, 2017, 7:04 pm 

Thank you for the informative replies. In the UK in a plug, blue represent neutral, brown represent live and green and yellow ''stripe'' represents Earth or ground.

However in the actual sockets we have twin and earth , I think that's about 2.5 mm to allow for the amp's, where in lighting is used 1.5mm twin and earth. If my memory serves me correct black and red with a copper ''solid'' earth that is naked but often dressed in the green and yellow sheaf.
Red being the ''hot'' wire although in some older houses I have seen this the opposite way around.

Are electromagnetic fields made of electrons? if so is the field ac or dc?
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Re: Boundary conditions

Postby Faradave on May 24th, 2017, 8:35 pm 

It's not easy to distinguish an electron from its fields. An electron wouldn't be an electron without its mass (gravitation) and electric charge. The actual "electron" can be described as simply the "location" central to these fields. There doesn't have to be a little speck of any "thing" there at all. Its OK to picture a dot in most cases.

But no, an electric field is not itself made up of electrons any more than a gravitational field is made up of tiny masses. However, in quantum electrodynamics (QED) the forces experienced by test particles, in the field of the particle in question, are said to be mediated by undetectable virtual particles. I don't think we should go in to that.
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