[Philosophy Crossover] Could Qualia be a Quantum phenomena

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[Philosophy Crossover] Could Qualia be a Quantum phenomena

Postby mm04926412 on February 6th, 2018, 5:24 pm 

Using Qualia as meaning the frame to frame experience of consciousness, as a purely... casual discussion and purely talking about whether such a thing is sufficient rather than necessary. Could consciousness be quantised and wave-like in nature?

Let us suppose there was some particle that experiences qualia, say a "Qualion" it seems entirely mathematically consistent to then describe a human consciousness as a quantum coupling of these qualion. Much like two electrons couple to form a combined system of two indistinguishable quanta. It would through the mathematics of Quantum possible to describe the human consciousness itself as a quantum coupling of these "Qualion", furthermore by positing consciousness as a wave form in at least some of the degrees of freedom of the Hilbert space we have defined consciousness in a physical way and there are already understood mechanism - obviously applied quite creatively that would allow such a coupled wave form to interact with a physical brain. If we do posit what has just been suggested, then we end up with a strange kind of physical only dualism where the computation and electrical chemical impulses of the brain could interact and operate on the conscious wave form just like anything else just clearly through a field and in dimensions non-standard perhaps non discovered and entirely orthogonal to the physical space the body and brain operate in, though admittedly it would be difficult to posit how this combined "Qualion" wave function could be localised in space whilst being in many ways clearly independent of it on the face of it this seems self consistent.

If the Qualia themselves were bosonic in nature, we would end up with a system where many many many Qualions somehow fall into states opened up by the physical mind, form a coupled single identity where until the death of the organism all Qualions experience "The whole" (This does give the rather mad conclusion that there are hundreds of trillions of "individual"s experiencing a single human life) interacting with the brain via "Qualia" 'bosons' exchanged in some hypothetical field, in a very black boxed way at least the Feynman diagram of such an interaction is draw-able. Though drastic this model would on the face of it have many desirable properties

1. Incorporates consciousness into the standard model

2. Explains why the brain seems to operate independently minus experience itself

3. Provides an immediately obvious answer to the split brain problem or any problem dealing with "dividing" consciousness in that the Qualions simply form two new coupled states and some portion of them continue interacting with the new "brains" in each direction.

4. Would explain why senses like sound taste touch and smell are intuitively "Wave like" and why the concepts of pitch, amplitude and wave form on some level - make sense - for example it seems to make sense to say sour has a higher pitch than bitter, and that since smell and taste are two aspects of the same thing it makes sense why they seem to form a super position in a wave like way.

5. Self-awareness implies that the qualions are at least giving something back to the brain and doing some form of computation, such a thing would be evolutionary useful and would make consciousness a continuous thing that has built up.

6. From a purely bayesian point of view if the actual mind "Qualions" couple to is irrelevant then the "Why did I of all people exist" question is irrelevant, the Qualion could have coupled to anything, from the perspective of the quallions there isn't a binary life and death simply being in a very simplistic lone state and sharing a combined experience of some physical brain in a far more complex way and experiencing rather than creating an identity. Would also make being a human more likely than animals due to more potential space for quallions in the overall wave form, specifically intelligent humans. From a Bayesian point of view if you are reading this and are an intelligent human being for you this gives this concept more weight.

7. Philosophical zombies would have measurable differences to actual humans in that none of these interactions take place, given previous experiments have achieved the shut down of consciousness and there were noticeable differences this seems to make sense.

8. Would explain why brain waves seem to propagate throughout the entire brain if this is some sort of mechanism of achieving coherence with the Quallion coupled state.

9. Hallucinations can be explained away as incoherence in the interactions with the quallions - "Mind expanding experiences" may come from drugs interefering with the brain and making it interact with them in ways it normally doesn't do at all, i.e the application of an operator to the state that is never applied in normal brain functioning and this having strange effects on the brain.

Some strange consequences

1. ID belongs to the brain not the traditional "mind", the "mind" is not doing any thinking, merely experiencing one brain before being delocalised on death to fall into the next available abstract "potential well" created by a complex living being. Many philosophical problems are solved in this case by making death and life merely different levels and complexity of experiences given to the Qualions via Qualia interactions with the physical world. You don't die you merely become "Less alive". Net result is a very strange physicalist kind of reincarnation assuming they can end up in another body when the one they are currently bound to stops existing.

2. Makes the human experience a hive mind - of sorts - though increasing the number of "Quales", i.e., that which experiences makes your existence more likely from a statistical point of view.

I'm not saying any of this is true, because that would be ridiculous without evidence, it would at least be interesting however to discuss if such a thing could have a coherent model created with this as the base idea and if it could be tested.

Thoughts from the community?
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Re: [Philosophy Crossover] Could Qualia be a Quantum phenome

Postby Dave_C on February 6th, 2018, 11:17 pm 

Hi m&m. Welcome to the board.

Why do you want to invoke QM? What is the benefit and why don't you see classical mechanics working as well?
Since your explanation is a function of objectively observables, why this explanation as opposed to any other explanation that shows correlation with behavior? In other words, if your objectively observable explanation has no more of an explanatory ability than an explanation using classical mechanics, what do you see as being unique and necessary about your concept?

I think you need to show why your concept is needed instead of the existing paradigm. Also, look up similar work in the literature. There's quite a lot of material. See authors Hameroff, Penrose, Sevush, Stapp (many others).

Explanations of the hard problem should also address the symbol grounding problem (Stevan Harnad).

Regards,
Dave.
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