Simone Weil: Science and Religion

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Simone Weil: Science and Religion

Postby Nick_A on March 12th, 2019, 10:08 pm 

I believe that one identical thought is to be found—expressed very precisely and with only slight differences of modality—in. . .Pythagoras, Plato, and the Greek Stoics. . .in the Upanishads, and the Bhagavad Gita; in the Chinese Taoist writings and. . .Buddhism. . .in the dogmas of the Christian faith and in the writings of the greatest Christian mystics. . .I believe that this thought is the truth, and that it today requires a modern and Western form of expression. That is to say, it should be expressed through the only approximately good thing we can call our own, namely science. This is all the less difficult because it is itself the origin of science. Simone Weil….Simone Pétrement, Simone Weil: A Life, Random House, 1976, p. 488

"To restore to science as a whole, for mathematics as well as psychology and sociology, the sense of its origin and veritable destiny as a bridge leading toward God---not by diminishing, but by increasing precision in demonstration, verification and supposition---that would indeed be a task worth accomplishing." Simone Weil


I know it is fashionable in these times to believe that the division between science and religion will increase. What if she is right and science will eventually prove the necessity for a conscious source of creation making possible facts being placed into a conscious human perspective as opposed to an egoistic self serving perspective. Is it possible? Will science prove the necessity for Plato's GOOD?
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Re: Simone Weil: Science and Religion

Postby BadgerJelly on March 12th, 2019, 10:15 pm 

I think it’s a false dichotomy. I’m don’t class them as being in the same pole.

Science and Art, yes. Religion has more in commom with Philosophy.
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Re: Simone Weil: Science and Religion

Postby Serpent on March 13th, 2019, 1:20 am 

No.
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Re: Simone Weil: Science and Religion

Postby BadgerJelly on March 13th, 2019, 3:18 am 

Nick -

How about expressing your understanding of Plato’s “Good”? That may help any potential discussion?
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Re: Simone Weil: Science and Religion

Postby Nick_A on March 13th, 2019, 12:28 pm 

BadgerJelly » March 12th, 2019, 10:15 pm wrote:I think it’s a false dichotomy. I’m don’t class them as being in the same pole.

Science and Art, yes. Religion has more in commom with Philosophy.


IMO we are entering remarkable time in which it will be possible to understand intellectually how science and the essence of religion are complimentary. Where science takes place along a horizontal plane of existence and functions by duality, the essence of religion is concerened with the vertical line of being which connects above and below along the great chain of being. Of course as of now this is all speculation.

A while back I became aware of Dr. Basarb Nicolescu's explanation of the Law of the Included Middle. I had always accepted the Law of non contradiction or the Law of the Excluded Middle and now see why they are not a contradiction. If true it proves through particle physics how matter proceeds along a vertical dimension or the third dimension of thought. Now that you think I've gone off the deep end, I'll let Dr. Nicolescu explain the Law of the Included Middle. Just get the basic idea and you will see how science by knowledge of the Law of the Included Middle will verify the vertical psychological inner direction which leads to the experience of objective meaning pursued by the essence of religion. By "essence of religion" I mean before its corruption into secularized religion.

http://ciret-transdisciplinarity.org/bulletin/b12c3.php


It makes perfect sense to me. On the horizontal plane of existence governed by duality A and non A cannot exist simultaneously. Yet from higher level of reality they can be included into one. Understanding this principle has lalowed me to understand how the devolution of knowledge into opinion described by Plato long with the evolution of diversity into unity takes plce. It does so in accordance with the law of the Included Middle.

Where science in the past limited itself to duality some like Dr. Nicolescu are opening to the Law of the Included Middle and its necessary lawful levels of reality. Science can appreciate how conscious evolution or the vertical conscious movement from a lower level of reality into higher one is possible if not probable.

The Good as described by Plato is the domain of non materialized ideas or forms within their conscious Source beyond the limits of time and space.. The process of creation is the vertical involution of ideas or forms into fractions of the whole in accordance with the Law of the included Middle. Evolution can then be defined as the return of the flow of forces to their origin: diversity into unity .

It seems to me that the hidden third principle is beginning to be recognized. Once it is the connection between the Law of the Excluded Middle with the Law of the included Middle becomes obvious as is the natural connection between the horizontal approach of science and the vertical approach of the essence of religion. Simone will have been proven ahead of her time.
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Re: Simone Weil: Science and Religion

Postby hyksos on March 20th, 2019, 1:07 pm 

Nick_A » March 13th, 2019, 8:28 pm wrote:Simone will have been proven ahead of her time.

This is very unlikely.

To restore to science as a whole, for mathematics as well as psychology and sociology, the sense of its origin and veritable destiny as a bridge leading toward God ---not by diminishing, but by increasing precision in demonstration, verification and supposition---that would indeed be a task worth accomplishing.

The God that Weil uses here is not the God of the American evangelical (a "personal God"). This is the God of Einstein and Newton. This is a mysterious incomprehensible entity that authored the laws of physics in a manner which is alien to humanity. This is not an entity that watches from the clouds as societies legalize abortion and sends hurricanes on them to punish.


Nick_A » March 13th, 2019, 8:28 pm wrote: science will eventually prove the necessity for a conscious source of creation making possible facts being placed into a conscious human perspective as opposed to an egoistic self serving perspective.

What???
I cannot parse this sentence .
I'm not sure what you are trying to ask here.
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