Ethics: Its use and meaning

Discussions that deal with moral issues. Key questions in ethics include: How should one live? What is right (or wrong) to do? What is the best way for humans to live?

Re: Ethics: Its use and meaning

Postby Athena on July 6th, 2017, 2:35 pm 

Does this work?

Is it reasonable to believe you can save the child?

Are you prepared to rescue someone from a fire? Do you know if you do the wrong thing, such as open a door, you can be the cause of someone dying? This is a test of your will to save someone from a fire. Begin by getting informed. If you do not determine to be well informed, your commitment to saving someone is low.

http://www.fireengineering.com/articles ... enemy.html

How physically fit are you? Do you intentionally exercise to be in top physical condition? Seriously, again this a test of how committed you are to saving someone. Do you physically prepare yourself? If not then your commit is low.

After you have done all you can do to be prepared to save someone, at the moment of emergency, using your knowledge, is it reasonable to assume you can save the child?

Do you have any other commitments, such as a family to support? Might this go into your decision of if you risk your life or not? I think it should. The outcome of any decision you make will affect everyone in your life. Isn't this also part of an ethical decision?
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Re: Ethics: Its use and meaning

Postby BadgerJelly on July 6th, 2017, 3:46 pm 

I guess you're getting the idea of what I mean. The point is not to say what anyone else should do to be prepared. The question is simply to ask yourself in this situation I would like to help? If so what would stop me, what would I weigh against it and where would I find the line between helping or not helping become blurred?

If you go deeper you can ask questions you would probably never feel like declaring in public, say there are two children a boy and a girl. You can only save one? You may then try and avoid the dilemma by saying "I would save the closest one", then you can say they are both equally in reach ... you will no doubt find yourself looking for a way out of making a conscious decision or maybe not? They may differ in age, race, intelligence, beauty, etc . These are not really thoughts we wish to openly express our choices about, and probably not ones we can justify to ourselves either.

It is for this reason I am openly avoiding any recourse to public debate about the "best" choice. The "best" choice spoken out is undoubtedly a choice framed in view of public opinion.

We can justify anything we wish with any reason. Most often we will fall prey to avoiding responsibility and relying on critical choice. By that I mean the choice over saving the boy or the girl is in every way impossible to reasonably justify, yet I do know what I would likely do in the situation.

The most difficult hypothetical ethical questions we can pose don't need to be omitted to the public domain. Only we as indivduals can come to terms with our thoughts about them on our own. To step into the community is to step into a world of less individual responsibility and to hide our true emotions.

The faults I see with my view are basically akin to the criticism of Virtue Ethics. My view is purposefully relativistic and vague. Maybe what I am saying is what was meant originally by the ancient Greeks? I am not sure because I have not read them extensively?

I generally opposed to the idea of some ethical system being placed in education. I don't think ethics can be taught (look at the religious claim on those grounds over the course of human history).

I have found a very strange place where when I dig deep enough the question becomes comparible to sitting on a green chair or on a blue chair, a leather chair or a plastic chair. Meaning I come to see that a lot of the choices I make are more about reflection after the event rather than the decision.

If I can save person A or person B I will inevitably have to deal with the joy of saving one and the remorse of not saving the other. The trick is to understand the importance of both the elation and the depression rather than dwelling in either. Many times we get caught up in the judgements of others and what others call "ethical" or "unethical" behavior.
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Re: Ethics: Its use and meaning

Postby Athena on July 6th, 2017, 9:32 pm 

Wait a minute, how prepared are you to save anyone? I think the Greeks would want to know. In their day, that emergency could be an invading army. In the past, physical ability was very important. Today we don't even get what physical fitness has to do contemplating rescuing someone from a burning building. That is a bit alarming.

Can we talk about liberal education and the reason for physical education classes?

Did you check out the link and learn about fires so if you are in that situation you will know what to do and what not to do? How meaningful is it to come to the decision that we should run into burning buildings to save a child if we do not back up this decision by preparing ourselves for such a moment?
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Re: Ethics: Its use and meaning

Postby BadgerJelly on July 7th, 2017, 2:58 am 

Athena » July 7th, 2017, 9:32 am wrote:Wait a minute, how prepared are you to save anyone? I think the Greeks would want to know. In their day, that emergency could be an invading army. In the past, physical ability was very important. Today we don't even get what physical fitness has to do contemplating rescuing someone from a burning building. That is a bit alarming.

Can we talk about liberal education and the reason for physical education classes?

Did you check out the link and learn about fires so if you are in that situation you will know what to do and what not to do? How meaningful is it to come to the decision that we should run into burning buildings to save a child if we do not back up this decision by preparing ourselves for such a moment?


No, I didn't check the link. You keep missing the point and obsessing over what others expect from you and this particular scenario of the fire. The scenario is merely a vehicle.

It doesn't matter if we are talking about saving someone from a fire or helping a person in the brown suit cross the road instead of a person in the black suit.

I don't see you breaking out of this rut anytime soon. May be better if you come back to this thread in a couple of weeks a read it afresh?
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Re: Ethics: Its use and meaning

Postby BadgerJelly on August 24th, 2017, 2:11 pm 

Athena -

This may help you get a better grip of what I am trying to point out:

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