Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Discussions ranging from space technology, near-earth and solar system missions, to efforts to understand the large-scale structure of the cosmos.

Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Many cosmologists believe that '' spacetime is curved ''
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The spacetime (as whole ) is cold continuum.
The light travels in this continuum in a straight line.
But near the hot masses of stars light can be curved.
Not spacetime curves but the movement of light is curved by hot masses.
#
Sun changes the road of light like a car changes its movement by road
but Euclidian geometry of Earth remains unchanged.
#
Sun (and its surrounded space) curves the straight movement of light quanta,
but the geometry of Pseudo Euclidian (Minkovski ) spacetime remains unchanged.

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socrat44
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Local Curvature of Space
According to Einstein’s theory of general relativity, massive objects warp
the spacetime around them, and the effect a warp has on objects is what we call gravity.
So, locally, spacetime is curved around every object with mass.

http://www.skyandtelescope.com/astronom ... f-spacece/

Only '' around every (local - hot) object with mass.'' light is curved.
The mass-objects in the universe (as whole) is very few.
Therefore the universe (as whole) is a flat spacetime (vacuum) continuum.

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socrat44
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Different objects and all different waves act in vacuum.
(one of vacuum's name is spacetime because in vacuum space and time are united)

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socrat44
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Space is the unity of loci. The "shape" is merely a mathematical representations of finite selections of loci that allow us to comprehend them intuitively.

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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Other than the OP subject, you are not asking a question? You are making statements. When I first read this, I didn't find any way to comment, so I thought I would wait and see how this developed. I think we know the answer to the question. Just not to sure of what your point is in asking.

Watson
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Watson » December 22nd, 2017, 12:28 pm wrote:Other than the OP subject, you are not asking a question?
You are making statements.
When I first read this, I didn't find any way to comment, so I thought I would wait
and see how this developed. I think we know the answer to the question.

I explain my opinion.
a)
The fourth dimension an absolute spacetime is the
negative two (-2) dimensions flat negative Pseudo Euclidian spacetime.
( + 4-D = -2D )
b)
We know only one system where apace and time are united and this
is Vacuum. Spacetime = Vacuum.
c)
From this absolute spacetime (vacuum) our three dimensions + time
Earth - gravity existence were created.
d)
You don't need 5-D, 11-D, 27-D . . . etc. to explain the Existence.

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socrat44
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

OT but when you google the OP lots of (to me) previously unknown science forums show up in the results.

That can be useful if ,like me you frequent more than a few -and the odd one can go down from time to time.

There are some very good contributors around and it is always nice to dig them out.
jocular
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

'' A world without masses, without electrons, without an
electromagnetic field is an empty world. Such an empty
world is flat. But if masses appear, if charged particles
appear, if an electromagnetic field appears then our world
becomes curved. Its geometry is Riemannian, that is, non- Euclidian.''
/ Book 'Albert Einstein', the page 116, by Leopold Infeld. /
#
Masses (like Sun's) can appear only in local places and therefore
the curvature can appear only in local places.

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socrat44
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?
The term '' absolute spacetime'' came from SRT.
SRT is theory without gravity-masses.
SRT describes physics in the absence of gravity-masses.
That means - the ''absolute spacetime'' ( without gravity-masses ) is flat continuum
and light / light quanta must (!) travel only (!) on straight line (!) and
not ''on geodesics '' / not on curved line as now some cosmologists think.

But the straight movement of light is curved by local gravity-masses: GRT.

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socrat44
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Book: ''What we cannot know'' by Marcus du Sautoy.

'' Gravity is actually the distortion of this space-time surface.
If something has mass, it curves the surface. The classic way to imagine
this is to consider space-time as a two-dimensional surface, and the effect
of mass as that of placing a ball on this surface. The ball pulls the surface
down, creating a well. Gravity can be thought of as the way things get
pulled down into this well.
This distortion of space-time has on interesting effect on light.''

''So in order to find the shortest space-time path. light will
follow a trajectory . . . .''

/page 270 /

'' . . . light would be bent by presence of a large mass.''
''. . . a curved space-time was provided by the British astronomer
Arthur Edington's observations . . .''
'' . . . light from distant stars would be bent by the gravitational
effect of the Sun.''
''The fact that the light did indeed seem to bent round objects of large mass
confirmed that the shortest paths weren't Euclidean straight lines but curved.''

/ page 271 /
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It seems that everything is correct.
Author, a British mathematician Marcus du Sautoy,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcus_du_Sautoy
only forgot to say that '' objects of large mass'' (like our Sun) in the
Universe as whole are very few and therefore the gravitations effects
are only local effects. Light is curved only near (!) the '' objects of large mass''
The gravity of our Sun doesn't have influence out of the solar system.
Gravity doesn't work in the Milky Way and therefore was invented so-called
''dark matter'' and ''dark energy'', a new words, a new speculations to prove
that ''gravity'' do indeed is fundamental (not local) effect for all the Universe.
#
If you see on the gate of lion the inscription ''cat'' . . . would you go inside?
The facts say: the absolute space-time (the Universe as whole) is flat
but modern ''scientific'' inscription is said '' Universe is +/- curved'' or
''spherical'' after '' the big-bang''.

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socrat44
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

Mathematical definitions of spacetime:
a) Plus 4D is spacetime.
b) Light-cone world is spacetime.
c) Minus 2D (pseudo Euclidian space) is spacetime.

And all these definitions is used to explain the space and time
(spacetime) where light is traveling.
#
Physical definition of spacetime:
the velocity of light in the vacuum (!) is constant and independent of its source,
#
Vacuum (!) is frictionless continuum.
All mathematical definitions of spacetime also must be frictionless continuum.
#
Without unity these definitions the SRT debates have no end.
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socrat44
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Re: Is Spacetime Flat or Curved ?

The world began not with a Bang, but with a Black Hole
Scientists challenge the Big Bang Theory of origin of the universe
Updated January 10, 2018 13:01 +08

http://www.ibtimes.sg/world-began-not-b ... hole-22669

===========================
Scientists have come up with a new theory about the origin of the universe,
and it does not involve a Big Bang! Instead, they are saying that the universe
was formed from the black hole of a previous cosmos.

Researchers from the Perimeter Institute have claimed that the Big Bang Theory,
which states that the world burst into existence from a singularity, seems unlikely.
"The big bang hypothesis has our relatively comprehensible, uniform,
and predictable universe arising from the physics-destroying insanity of a singularity
It seems unlikely," they say, as reported by Outer Places.

Instead, according to them, it is more likely that black hole is at the bottom of the matter
as they have the capability of creating as well as destroying celestial bodies, majorly stars.

According to the new theory, our universe has been formed by a fourth-dimensional black hole
that is a part of another universe. In that case, we are living beyond the horizon of the event
and it is also possible that other universes have been created by black holes in the 'parent universe.'

This theory solves the 'information paradox' related to black holes that have been confusing
scientists for many years. It states that all information and physical matter disappears permanently
into the black hole, where all physical states devolve into the same state.

If we apply this explanation to this theory, it would seem that the matter going inside a black hole
is not destroyed after all. Instead, it forms a part of a new universe.

http://www.ibtimes.sg/world-began-not-b ... hole-22669

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Where does the matter for '' a fourth-dimensional black hole'' come from ?
Where does matter for ''previous cosmos.'' come from ?
The matter came from '' another universe''.
And the matter for ''another universe'' came from some ''another fourth-dimensional black hole''
And so down - down . . . .

The Earth stands on tortoise and this tortoise stands on another tortoise
and so down - down . . . to infinity.

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socrat44
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