Was Einstein’s Theory of Relativity … Wrong?

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Was Einstein’s Theory of Relativity … Wrong?

Postby socrat44 on October 15th, 2019, 7:23 am 

Was Einstein’s Theory of Relativity … Wrong?
---
Scientists are now questioning whether Albert Einstein was wrong
when it comes to his theory of relativity, which set the speed of light
at 186,000 miles per second and became essential to the
development of modern physics.
According to The Daily Express, Einstein’s theory came into question
when it was discovered that NASA’s Hubble telescope captured
objects traveling five times the speed of light in the Messier 87 galaxy..

https://www.insidehook.com/daily_brief/ ... vity-wrong
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Re: Was Einstein’s Theory of Relativity … Wrong?

Postby BurtJordaan on October 15th, 2019, 8:40 am 

The referenced article answers the question in the negative, so the headline was just a bit of an eye-catcher...
OR modern creative journalism.
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Re: Was Einstein’s Theory of Relativity … Wrong?

Postby socrat44 on October 15th, 2019, 9:50 am 

BurtJordaan » October 15th, 2019, 8:40 am wrote:The referenced article answers the question in the negative,
so the headline was just a bit of an eye-catcher...
OR modern creative journalism.


On one hand after BB (on some level) the universe began
expanding faster than speed of light, on the other hand,
black hole swallow objects faster than light . . .
/ Cosmology . . . Astrophysics . . . Alice in Wonderland /
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Re: Was Einstein’s Theory of Relativity … Wrong?

Postby BurtJordaan on October 15th, 2019, 11:11 am 

socrat44 » 15 Oct 2019, 15:50 wrote:.. on the other hand, black hole swallow objects faster than light . . .

Not quite, those were particles flung out from just outside the the event horizon of the BH by the immense the magnetic field of the BH.
http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt wrote:Our present understanding is that this `superluminal motion'
occurs when these clouds move towards Earth at speeds very close to that
of light, in this case, more than 98 percent of the speed of light. At
these speeds the clouds nearly keep pace with the light they emit as they
move towards Earth, so when the light finally reaches us, the motion appears
much more rapid than the speed of light.
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Re: Was Einstein’s Theory of Relativity … Wrong?

Postby socrat44 on October 16th, 2019, 6:46 am 

BurtJordaan » October 15th, 2019, 11:11 am wrote:
socrat44 » 15 Oct 2019, 15:50 wrote:.. on the other hand, black hole swallow objects faster than light . . .

Not quite, those were particles flung out from just outside the the event horizon of the BH by the immense the magnetic field of the BH.
http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt wrote:Our present understanding is that this `superluminal motion'
occurs when these clouds move towards Earth at speeds very close to that
of light, in this case, more than 98 percent of the speed of light. At
these speeds the clouds nearly keep pace with the light they emit as they
move towards Earth, so when the light finally reaches us, the motion appears
much more rapid than the speed of light.

HUBBLE DETECTS FASTER-THAN-LIGHT MOTION IN GALAXY M87


Astronomers reported today discovering clouds which appear to
move many times faster than the speed of light, shooting out
from the region of a black hole at the center of the M87 galaxy.
These results help explain the nature of distant quasars and
``BL Lac'' objects.

``We see almost a dozen clouds which appear to be moving out from the
galaxy's center at between four and six times the speed of light.
These are all located in a narrow jet of gas streaming out from the
region of the black hole at the galaxy's center," said Dr. John Biretta
of the Space Telescope Science Institute. ``We believe this apparent
speed translates into an actual velocity just slightly below that of light
itself."

Biretta and his colleagues Duccio Macchetto, William Sparks, and
Eric Perlman announced the results at a meeting of the American
Astronomical Society in Austin, Texas.

The speeds reported are two to three times faster than the
fastest motions previously recorded in M87, the only nearby
galaxy to show evidence for superluminal motion.
``This discovery goes a long way towards confirming that
radio galaxies, quasars and exotic BL Lac objects are basically
the same beast, powered by super massive black holes, and differ
only in orientation with respect to the observer," Biretta said.
``Here we have, for the first time, a fairly normal radio galaxy with
both excellent evidence for a super-massive black hole, as well as
superluminal jet speeds similar to those seen in distant quasars
and BL Lac objects."

The result also represents a first for the Hubble Space Telescope.
``This is the first time superluminal motion has been seen
with any optical telescope, and this discovery was made possible by
the extremely fine resolution obtained by Hubble,'' said Macchetto.

http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt
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Re: Lost at c

Postby Faradave on October 16th, 2019, 11:18 am 

socrat44 wrote:"We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity just slightly below that of light itself."
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Re: Lost at c

Postby socrat44 on October 16th, 2019, 6:21 pm 

Faradave » October 16th, 2019, 11:18 am wrote:
socrat44 wrote:"We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity just slightly below that of light itself."



no matter ''speed'', the idea is important . . . ''the spittle of the Big-Bang the Black hole swallows''
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Re: Was Einstein’s Theory of Relativity … Wrong?

Postby A_Seagull on October 16th, 2019, 11:06 pm 

lots of things can appear to move faster than the speed of light. If you aim a laser at the moon and wiggle it about the point of light ( if you could detect it) could move faster than the speed of light.

If you have a beam of light-emitting particles being ejected by an active far away object that is aimed very close to the line of sight with the Earth then it can appear that the source of the light is moving away from the object faster than the speed of light, but it is just a perspective thing, an illusion.
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Re: Down the drain and up again?

Postby Faradave on October 16th, 2019, 11:15 pm 

socrat44 wrote:"the spittle of the Big-Bang the Black hole swallows"

And where does all that lost mass-energy go?

One characterization of a black hole event horizon is the boundary at which infalling particles attain speed limit c. Exceeding that equates to backward temporal displacement. In a model where cosmic aging occurs radially outward, falling through an event horizon might recycle such particles back to a single, central "white hole" event (i.e. Big Bang).
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